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Xref: sserve comp.os.386bsd.development:2108 comp.os.mach:3812 comp.unix.bsd:13943 comp.unix.pc-clone.32bit:6266 Newsgroups: comp.os.386bsd.development,comp.os.mach,comp.unix.bsd,comp.unix.pc-clone.32bit Path: sserve!newshost.anu.edu.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!msuinfo!uwm.edu!cs.utexas.edu!usc!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!decwrl!netcomsv!netcom.com!jmonroy From: jmonroy@netcom.com (Jesus Monroy Jr) Subject: Re: Details on the 386BSD Release 1.0 CD-ROM Message-ID: <jmonroyCpw3os.CnK@netcom.com> Organization: NETCOM On-line Communication Services (408 261-4700 guest) X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL1] References: <jmonroyCprpBJ.LpL@netcom.com> <JKH.94May14052314@whisker.hubbard.ie> <JKH.94May15183554@whisker.hubbard.ie> Date: Mon, 16 May 1994 09:58:04 GMT Lines: 196 mail jkh@whisker.hubbard.ie Re: Subject: Re: Details on the 386BSD Release 1.0 CD-ROM This is getting really silly. >> In article <jmonroyCptu4u.Bqr@netcom.com> jmonroy@netcom.com (Jesus Monroy Jr) writes: >> >> These are quite a few rough words, when neither >> you nor I have seen the code. As this is the case, >> (that neither one of us has seen the code) I won't >> comment on your comment. >> >> I can go by past experience just as well as the next person, Jesus, >> and `innocent until proven guilty' only applies for me when the >> parties in question haven't been proven guilty in every previous >> instance.. :-) >> Well if you had bothered to quote me, I might have responded to your comments. Seeing as you did not quote me... I won't comment on your comment. >> Then came along some very bad companies. They >> did not like Bill. Bill did not like them. >> They argued. They called each other nasty names. >> Neither Bill nor the companies talk to each other >> much now-a-days. >> >> I'm not surprised. Bill, having all the negotiational skills of >> Joseph Stalin, no doubt turned a number of small tiffs into full-scale >> wars, which just goes to show that proper handling of the politics >> surrounding a project are at least as important as the technical >> issues (in some cases more so). In any case, there is a lesson to be >> learned here from Bill, and I hope those wishing to start their own >> free software efforts are taking heed of it. Don't alienate your >> users, and don't poke sleeping giants with sticks! :-) >> Are you speaking for the alienated users or the sleeping giants? >> Along with these upset people were people that >> thought they knew what was right. And they >> thought Bill was wrong. They also argued >> and disagreed with Bill. Bill became very upset. >> Some said he was a very bad person. They said that >> Bill said bad things. This was not good. >> >> In the days that followed, Bill left and decided to >> take his OS with him. He did not want play with the >> rest of the kids. This made they rest of the kids very >> upset. They called Bill nasty names. They also >> became very upset if anybody mention Bill's name. >> Everyone yelled and scream and was very upset. >> >> I just love this prose, folks. Not only is it wildly innaccurate >> regarding the sequence and intensity of events, it also grossly over- >> simplifies just about every aspect of that history. Jesus, if we >> wanted the cartoon version of the *BSD history we'd have asked for it. >> What are you talking about!?! ... you did ask for it. >> You should also get your facts straight and perhaps spend a little bit >> of time talking to all those `bad folks' who spend hours and hours, >> not to mention many dollars, engaged in long-distance phone calls with >> Bill, trying to get some idea of what was going on and listening to >> his increasingly extravagant promises. >> This is your best run-on sentence yet. >> We never asked him to do >> anything special for us, we simply wanted the truth! You seem to >> share his aversion for it, prefering hyperbole and gross exaggeration >> instead. >> Well, I'll agree that some things get coloured by my perception, but a gross exaggeration is just a gross exaggeration. >> >> Today we have FreeBSD and friends, NetBSD and friends, >> and 386bsd and friends. No one can agree on what to do. >> No will agree to talk. To add to this a nasty wanna-be-wizard >> named jmonroy@netcom.com is telling everyone. >> This is making everyone upset, again. >> >> We talk all the time, Jesus. I don't know anything about the 386BSD >> camp since NONE OF THE BLOODY "DEVELOPERS" of 386BSD EVER SAY ANYTHING! >> The most interesting part of this whole conversation is the fact that I'm quite willing to concede that F***BSD and N**BSD have been doing more -- by definition. However, you seem addimate(sp?) on the persicution(sp?) of my drivel. (There I spelled drivel correctly... Happpy.) As a matter of fact, maybe you missed my subliminal message of using upper case for N & F and lower case for Bill's version. So what's my point? I have no point at this time. I really am not inclined to continue this conversation at your tone. >> Physician, heal thyself! How many here have heard advance reports of >> what would be in this surprise release of 386BSD 1.0? How many can >> claim to have worked on it? Now how many 386BSD users went over to >> FreeBSD or NetBSD because of the total lack of committment to them >> shown by Bill and his unknown cronies? You can put your hands down >> now, thank you. >> What the hell is your problem?!? Months ago -- I asked many members if they were willing to talk about the *new* version of 386bsd when it came out. You were amoung these people. Now, I am supposed to beleive that Satan and his disciples have come to avenge the ruthless Empire. Give me a damm break! Let's get to the OS talk -- and quit this silly conversation. My interest is in OS development and my software projects. So I will pray that at this juncture we will see what we must do and continue. God help us all. >> What this amounts to is the open development groups coming under fire >> for being `not open enough' from a group that's always had restricted >> membership and zero "public responsibility" in how they let people in >> on the process, which is just ludicrous to say the least. >> Well, I'll agree with this -- something you said was definitely ludicrous. >> The moral of this story really is: No matter how far they have to >> distort the truth to support their claims, Bill and Jesus are always >> right. As always, these arguments are pointless - how can you argue >> with someone who spends his life in an alternate dimension where black >> is white and white is black? >> I'm wondering if I should even answer such a crude statement. 1) I don't see any reason in defending a non-truth. 2) This story has no morals. 3) You said "how can you argue with someone". I'm glad we're down to one person on this. ===================================================================== mail storm@cs.mcgill.ca Re: Subject: Re: Details on the 386BSD Release 1.0 CD-ROM >> Date: 15 May 1994 18:57:00 GMT >> In article <jmonroyCptu4u.Bqr@netcom.com>, >> Jesus Monroy Jr <jmonroy@netcom.com> wrote: >> > >> > Then came along some very bad companies. They >> > did not like Bill. Bill did not like them. >> > They argued. They called each other nasty names. >> > Neither Bill nor the companies talk to each other >> > much now-a-days. >> >> of course, bill just so happened to be working for some of >> these 'bad' companies at the time, but this tends to be >> rather convenient to ignore. >> It's *convenient* to leave it out, because the bad company will deny that Bill work with them. (New 386bsd fans: This message is convenient to ignore.) ===================================================================== Last Note: Anyone else planning to follow up on these comments is only taking the flame-bait. (This comment is a flame-bait.) -- Jesus Monroy Jr jmonroy@netcom.com Zebra Research /386BSD/device-drivers /fd /qic /clock /documentation ___________________________________________________________________________