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Newsgroups: comp.os.386bsd.questions Path: sserve!newshost.anu.edu.au!munnari.oz.au!spool.mu.edu!howland.reston.ans.net!europa.eng.gtefsd.com!newsxfer.itd.umich.edu!zip.eecs.umich.edu!umn.edu!newsdist.tc.umn.edu!uum1!newsserver!mark From: mark@jupiter.aggregate.com (Mark P. Gooderum, Software Engineer) Subject: Re: NetBSD-0.9 to FreeBSD-??? Sender: usenet@newsserver.aggregate.com (Usenet News Administrative Account) Message-ID: <MARK.94Jul15152157@jupiter.aggregate.com> In-Reply-To: paul@isl-gate.elsy.cf.ac.uk's message of Fri, 15 Jul 1994 10:25:28 +0000 Date: Fri, 15 Jul 1994 20:21:57 GMT References: <3031ps$d1u@dopey.cc.utexas.edu> <michaelv.774191014@ponderous.cc.iastate.edu> <1994Jul15.102530.17910@cm.cf.ac.uk> Nntp-Posting-Host: jupiter.aggregate.com Organization: Aggregate Computing, Inc. Lines: 67 > This is undoubtedly going to be considered inflammatory but I just don't > accept the claim that NetBSD-1.0 is a "completely 4.4BSD-lite based kernel" > since merging in bits of 4.4 to the existing NetBSD tree does not constitute > in my opinion a completely 4.4-lite based system. Okay, the NetBSD kernel may not be completely 4.4BSD-lite based. However, calling the 4.4 stuff integrated "little bits" is an understatement. Vast chunks of it are and it is the first unencumbered free BSD OS (while, as much as you can call it that with the GPL'd parts, but we all have that issue). In the last four months almost all of the kernel stuff that matters has been pulled in, the VM, the filesystem code, the sysctl() interface, etc. Much of the userland has been upgraded, other parts integrated. > Incidentally, a completeley 4.4BSD-lite kernel wouldn't mean an > unencumbered system since the whole Net-2 tape is encumbered. > ANY file which can be traced back to that tape which you still have > will encumber the release. This is a mis-assumption. The USL settlement doesn't magically encumber the whole Net2 tree. Parties of the settlement are bound by that settlement. However, there is much in Net2 that clearly had outside origin and was contributed. Gcc obviously isn't USL encumbered because it showed up on Net2. Anyone else contributing didn't magically surrender their intellectual property rights. An important thing to realize also is that the USL settlement is just that, settlement. There has been **no** legal precedent set in this case. There is the practical reality of who can pay their lawyers the best as the free software people have encountered, on the otherhand given the USL's willingness to settle with many of these parties without too much trouble (face it, if they wanted to spend the money and tie all of the XXXBSD's up in court forever, they could...). Given that, they are highly unlikely to pursue claims regarding any software on Net2 that has clear independant origin and support (again Gcc is a strong example). Anything left in NetBSD either isn't Net2 or has it's own clear public origin independant of Net2, even if earlier versions were on Net2 (things like make, sendmail, etc). To the best of my knowledge, any code brought from 4.4 brought the man pages as well. Obviously some/much code has other origins and there may be missed bits. Also, there certainly are improvments and bug fixes over 4.4 in the NetBSD code. The filesystem code certainly has had a ton of fixes and is very solid (excluding LFS), a claim that just wasn't as true of things in 4.4. I try to stay out of OS wars and I'll try to stay out here. Each has it's strength. If you have some Macs, and maybe a Sparc 1+ or Sparc 2 (their used prices aren't that bad), and some x86 boxes, you're obviously not going to run FreeBSD. On the otherhand, NetBSD's install isn't as solid as FreeBSD and a lot of people are more comfortable if they can actually "buy" it (admittedly stretching the def...by hey, Unix for the *real* masses doesn't mean anonymous ftp, at least not yet). Different people have different priorities. I needed multi-platform support, so my choice was made. That doesn't mean it was the best or only one for anyone else... -Mark