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Xref: sserve comp.os.386bsd.misc:4959 comp.os.linux.misc:33715 comp.os.os2.advocacy:75017 Newsgroups: comp.os.386bsd.misc,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.os2.advocacy Path: sserve!newshost.anu.edu.au!munnari.oz.au!spool.mu.edu!howland.reston.ans.net!nntp.crl.com!ka4ybr!mah From: mah@ka4ybr.com (Mark A. Horton KA4YBR) Subject: Re: Linux thoroughly insulted by Infoworld! Followup-To: comp.os.386bsd.misc,comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.os2.advocacy X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Organization: Mark Horton Associates Message-ID: <1995Jan21.045834.11541@ka4ybr.com> References: <950116203411@lambada> <1995Jan18.214037.6088@cs.cornell.edu> <3fk4hi$iu8@solaris.cc.vt.edu> <1995Jan19.015527.16465@cs.cornell.edu> Date: Sat, 21 Jan 1995 04:58:34 GMT Lines: 69 Matt Welsh (mdw@cs.cornell.edu) wrote: : In article <3fk4hi$iu8@solaris.cc.vt.edu> mmead@goof.com (matthew c. mead) writes: : > Catch a clue. You're in school, you have the time to play around with : >it all you want. If you'd ever been in industry, you would know the need for : >product support. Can you call Linus and say, "My serial port isn't working : >right. What do I do?" No. Can you call up Sun, or BSDI and do the same? : >Yes. Mission-critical applications need to have a supported OS. And for : >industry, on the net, donated help is not an option. : I guess you didn't take the time to read my article before firing off : this uninformed flame. First of all, I have been in industry for a number : of years, so I know how it works. And there are two ways of looking at it. : If something's wrong with Linux, it's usually much easier to "call up" : or e-mail the responsible person and either get a fix or hack the source : yourself. If you're a big compaNY and one of Sun or BSDI's major customers, : maybe you can call them up and get results quickly---but this isn't always : the case. The companies that I have worked for have sometimes had this : clout, and other times have had no luck in getting problems resolved : in a reasonable amount of time. I would argue that the variance in turnaround : time for fixing Linux problems is somewhat less. : My argument was that your experience will seriously taint your judgement : of a system such as Linux. It sounds like you have had favourable experience : with commercial operating systems and response from the vendor for resolving : problems. My experience has been somewhat mixed, and I'm sure many Linux : users would join me in agreeing that major problems and bugs are fixed : very, very quickly via e-mail consultation with the developers. I've : sent off bug reports and had developers mail me a patch in a matter of : hours, and I've also been able to fix problems myself with the source code. : Catch a clue, indeed. : mdw Well said, Matt! (check the system name on the fellow's email address!:) I've been in this business for 23 years, most of which was in technical support and technical support management in LARGE IBM shops... When your support for "mission critical" applications (which I would venture to say that online-lab systems and the like in a hospital environment qualify as) depends upon telephone support to a level-one help desk that will queue your request for a (sorta) real technician at level two for a 4-hour callback so that you can get a patch for your "object-code-only" operating system, you learn to develop alternative methods of support... Linux support through the documentation, source code, email contact with authors, developers, and interested parties, and as a last resort posting on the net is, IMHO, an incredibly superior approach to the old "vendor support" argument. I think the entire "vendor support" argument is, in reality, another way of saying "Whew! There's a problem! I can blame it on the vendor and so I won't have to justify why I'm incapable of solving this problem!" Same argument that keeps consultants employed at very high rates! It gives everyone an external "boogeyman" to blame for failure... no one is really hurt if the consultant is fired - consultant still gets his bucks, client personnel say "I told you so!", management's off the hook with upper managment, and who gives a damn if the user's problem is solved anyway? Right? Wake up Mr. Mead. Assume some responsibility. Earn your paycheck. Or better yet, "Catch a clue." :) Mark -- Everything I learned to make me a UNIX guru I learned in grammar school... it was under the general subject entitled "reading." ------------------------------------------------------------ Mark A. Horton ka4ybr mah@ka4ybr.atlanta.com Systems and Network Performance Tuning mah@ka4ybr.atl.ga.us +1.404.371.0291 : 33 45 31 N / 084 16 59 W mah@ka4ybr.com