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From: jkh@violet.berkeley.edu (Jordan K. Hubbard)
Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.advocacy,comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc,comp.unix.advocacy,comp.unix.misc
Subject: Linux vs FreeBSD - enough, finito, PAX please!
Date: 11 Dec 1995 14:03:00 GMT
Organization: University of California, Berkeley
Lines: 62
Message-ID: <4ahdmk$ebr@agate.berkeley.edu>
References: <489kuu$rbo@pelican.cs.ucla.edu> <49rm0g$o8o@daffy.anetsrvcs.uwrf.edu> <DJ2IBL.71t@nntpa.cb.att.com> <4ah39c$mt3@klaava.helsinki.fi>
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In article <4ah39c$mt3@klaava.helsinki.fi>,
Linus Torvalds <torvalds@cc.Helsinki.FI> wrote:
> [comments about why he choses the development model he does]
Big Sigh. You know, this may sound strange, but I was actually hoping
that Linus wouldn't get dragged into this silly thread - it seems a
monumental waste of anyone's time to debate highly religious issues like
this ("catholic!" "no! no! protestant!" [they kill eachother]), but it's
all the worse when someone who really doesn't have the time to spare
is forced to defend the development methodology he and others use to create
freely available code.
Perhaps that's the essential lesson to be learned here. Whether the
GPL or the BSD copyright is used, we have to keep in mind the INTENTIONS
of the people involved. A little friendly rivalry is all well and
good, but consider the analogy of two rival football coaches: They
may occasionally play on opposite sides of the field, but both are
there for the SAME reason - they love football and wouldn't do anything
else. If they're reasonably mature individuals they'll even get together
after the game for a beer, regardless of the outcome, and discuss some
of the great games of their careers.
Where John and I got dragged into this was when someone started making
statements about the openness of BSD, and we felt compelled to correct
what we felt were unfair generalizations. In retrospect, I personally
somewhat regret doing so, though I do have to admit that some good came out
of this whole sorry affair - it induced me to fight for and win the right
to open general read access to our CVS repository (in addition to sup, it's
also now up for ftp on ftp.freebsd.org).
I'd also like to state for the record that anyone wishing to debate
the merits of the GPL vs BSD will do so at their own peril (see "catholic"
vs "protestant" above) and it's almost certain not to end positively.
To make a case in point, I remember a conversation that Michael K Johnson
and I once had about the idea of doing an article in the Linux Journal
concerning the relative merits of the two copyrights. Both Michael
and I are pretty reasonable individuals, and we didn't even intend to
debate the topic personally - we were just talking about *arranging*
a debate. Well, I'm embarassed to say that, somehow, one small comment
led to another and in a surprisingly short amount of time we were both
*shouting* at one another! Fortunately, I managed to come to my senses
about halfway through and sent him a "jeeze, just how the heck did we
manage to come to THIS?" message which cooled things down, and we both
sheepishly agreed that maybe such a debate *wasn't* such a good idea.
Like politics, religion and the choice of pizza toppings, this topic seems
to simply *invite* gratitous bloodshed.
So I'd like to call for a stand-down on this whole topic. I will not
follow-up to any further debate myself, doing my part for global peace
and world understanding. It's not a debate that can be "won", nor is there
even such a thing as "right and wrong" that either side can claim. There
is only *preference*. We prefer the BSD copyright, you prefer the GPL.
I prefer pepperoni, you prefer sausage. Why can't we all just get along? :-)
Furthermore, since I know that Linus and I will both be at USENIX this year,
I will extend the offer of one pizza (with everything on it, of course -
I'm not a total idiot :) to Linus. We can discuss anything but operating
systems and license agreements. How 'bout it, Linus?
:-)
Jordan