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Path: euryale.cc.adfa.oz.au!newshost.anu.edu.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!news.mira.net.au!news.mel.connect.com.au!munnari.OZ.AU!metro!metro!asstdc.scgt.oz.au!nsw.news.telstra.net!act.news.telstra.net!imci3!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in1.uu.net!webster.bfm.com!uunet!inXS.uu.net!news.bb.net!news.blarg.net!blarg.net!vanevery From: vanevery@blarg.net (Brandon J. Van Every) Newsgroups: comp.graphics.api.misc,comp.graphics.algorithms,comp.windows.x.i386unix,gnu.misc.discuss,comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc,comp.os.linux.development.apps Subject: Re: Freeware community needs 3d library NOW Followup-To: comp.graphics.api.misc,comp.graphics.algorithms,comp.windows.x.i386unix,gnu.misc.discuss,comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc,comp.os.linux.development.apps Date: 29 Jun 1996 04:54:43 GMT Organization: Blarg! Online Services 206/441-9109 Lines: 52 Message-ID: <4r2cuj$q13@guysmiley.blarg.net> References: <4qlf04$7pj@guysmiley.blarg.net> <4qnkur$sr1@thor.xon.cuug.ab.ca> <4qt6im$ne9@guysmiley.blarg.net> <Dtnuy5.7pt@telly.telly.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: animal.blarg.net X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2] Xref: euryale.cc.adfa.oz.au comp.graphics.api.misc:673 comp.graphics.algorithms:29129 comp.windows.x.i386unix:20394 gnu.misc.discuss:26800 comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc:22422 comp.os.linux.development.apps:18203 Evan Leibovitch (evan@telly.telly.org) wrote: : In article <4qt6im$ne9@guysmiley.blarg.net>, : Brandon J. Van Every <vanevery@blarg.net> wrote: : Say, for the moment, that the exact same situation holds true for the 3d : world. A company like X Inside could start supporting these accelerators, : making them available for Linux. While such drivers would be non-free, : they'd still be a helluva lot less expensive than their SPARC or SGI : equivalents. But not less expensive than their Windows 95 or NT equivalents. Most folks have Win3.1 lying around somewhere... an upgrade to Win95 is a mere $90, and that buys the 3d libs (OpenGL, Direct3d) and the widest variety of market-competitive commodity hardware to choose from. And if you bought your computer recently, the cost of Win95 is $0. Given Microsoft's heavy-duty committment to 3d technology, the economics of Linux don't make any sense for 3d graphics. Unless you have a previous and steadfast committment to X11. : Then again, nothing is stopping you (or anyone else) from signing an NDA : with an accelerator maker, then writing and shipping your own freeware : driver in binary-only form. People can _pay_ me to do that. (DEC does. :-) : Not available in freeware != not available for Linux. Point noted. It's a big labor problem, though. It's the same problem as for shrink-wrap UNIX apps in general. They are significantly more expensive under UNIX, without offering tangible benefits over their Windows counterparts. I see a freely available, high-performance 3d API as a possible way around the problem. A really good one, could attract serious 3d development to the freeware UNIXen, and then market competition would lower the cost of 3d UNIX apps. But there's the rub: the lib has to be really, really good. An adequate one will be good for hackers and academics, but it won't attract real commercial 3d development. Also, my current thinking is that the lib probably has to be OpenGL, and not Free3d or a Direct3d clone. (Offline, Brian Paul and Allen Akin have persuaded me that a high-performance OpenGL is tenable, albeit a lot of work.) I'm looking at the Mesa sources to see what can be done. Cheers, -- Brandon J. Van Every | Check out Free3d, my 100% efficient, 100% portable | 3d lib, at <http://www.blarg.net/~vanevery>. 3d Computer Graphics | C++ UNIX X11 WinNT | E-mail: vanevery@blarg.net