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Path: euryale.cc.adfa.oz.au!newshost.carno.net.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!lucy.swin.edu.au!news.rmit.EDU.AU!goanna.cs.rmit.edu.au!news.apana.org.au!cantor.edge.net.au!news.mira.net.au!news.netspace.net.au!news.mel.aone.net.au!grumpy.fl.net.au!news.webspan.net!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!worldnet.att.net!hunter.premier.net!uunet!in3.uu.net!136.142.185.26!newsfeed.pitt.edu!bb3.andrew.cmu.edu!andrew.cmu.edu!sumner+ From: Gerry S Hayes <sumner@CMU.EDU> Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd.bsdi.misc,comp.unix.bsd.misc,comp.os.linux.misc Subject: Re: Linux vs BSD Date: Thu, 6 Feb 1997 14:34:56 -0500 Organization: Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA Lines: 39 Distribution: comp Message-ID: <0myX9U200YUf09B6Y0@andrew.cmu.edu> References: <32DFFEAB.7704@usa.net> <Pine.SOL.3.91.970201040446.16129A-100000@ux8.cso.uiuc.edu> <32F3810D.237C228A@FreeBSD.org> <5d299q$i6r@josie.abo.fi> <5d80q2$8cn@cynic.portal.ca> NNTP-Posting-Host: po7.andrew.cmu.edu In-Reply-To: <5d80q2$8cn@cynic.portal.ca> Xref: euryale.cc.adfa.oz.au comp.unix.bsd.bsdi.misc:5905 comp.unix.bsd.misc:2325 comp.os.linux.misc:156628 cjs@cynic.portal.ca (Curt Sampson) writes: > In article <5d299q$i6r@josie.abo.fi>, Mats Andtbacka <mandtbac@abo.fi> wrote: > > > >(and no, i don't see Linux as being "fragmented" due to there being > >different distributions. that's because i don't buy Stallman's silly > >argument that "the utilities are part of the OS"; the kernel, in my > >opinion, defines the OS, and there can be only one Linux kernel.) > > So how many people do you know running just the Linux kernel, > without any of those GNU utilities or shells? > The same number as those I know who run Win95 without Microsoft Word (Or Minesweeper, for that matter). None. So what? The GNU utilities are some of the most useful applications for Linux; some of them (emacs, gcc) are some of the most useful applications for *BSD as well. They still aren't part of the OS, by my definition. (To me, the OS is the abstraction from hardware. I can write software that doesn't care about the hardware if you give me the Linux kernel; the same binaries will run if I change hard drives, CPUs, motherboards, mice, whatever. I can't if you take the kernel away. The device drivers in the X distribution are part of the OS by this definition, and I'm a cautious supporter of the GGI project to seperate the device drivers from the X server, SVGALib, or other windowing system.) It takes an OS and applications to have a usable computing environment. I think that gcc alone warrants the mention of GNU and the FSF when talking about free Unices, and I always try to give Stallman et alia their due; I also try to give the XFree folks, Larry Wall, D. E. Knuth, the BSD folk, and others their due. C'est la guerre. Cordially, Sumner -- Respond by post or email, but please don't CC: postings to me; my mailbox is already quite full.