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From: j@ida.interface-business.de (J Wunsch) Newsgroups: comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc,comp.unix.bsd.netbsd.misc,comp.unix.bsd.openbsd.misc,comp.unix.bsd.misc Subject: Re: *BSD Unification? Date: 3 Apr 1997 13:44:55 GMT Organization: interface business GmbH, Dresden Lines: 78 Message-ID: <5i0c8n$45t@innocence.interface-business.de> References: <860029226.1885@dejanews.com> Reply-To: joerg_wunsch@interface-business.de (Joerg Wunsch) NNTP-Posting-Host: ida.interface-business.de X-Newsreader: knews 0.9.6 X-Phone: +49-351-31809-14 X-Fax: +49-351-3361187 X-PGP-Fingerprint: DC 47 E6 E4 FF A6 E9 8F 93 21 E0 7D F9 12 D6 4E Path: euryale.cc.adfa.oz.au!newshost.carno.net.au!harbinger.cc.monash.edu.au!munnari.OZ.AU!news.Hawaii.Edu!news.lava.net!news.flex.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.uio.no!newsfeed.nacamar.de!news-kar1.dfn.de!news-fra1.dfn.de!news-koe1.dfn.de!main.Germany.EU.net!Dortmund.Germany.EU.net!interface-business.de!usenet Xref: euryale.cc.adfa.oz.au comp.unix.bsd.freebsd.misc:38426 comp.unix.bsd.netbsd.misc:5741 comp.unix.bsd.openbsd.misc:50 comp.unix.bsd.misc:2939 prw@cyberwar.com wrote: > ... if all of the BSD camps > worked in unison rather than on separate projects. This issue is > brought up time and time again, but it never seems to be given the > attention it warrants. Never given the attention is a sheer understatement. We've been paying attention to it from time to time, and remember, there once has been an effort to unite NetBSD and FreeBSD which miserably failed, and only served as a lesson to those who've been attempting it. As the free BSDs work now, there are personality problems (see the split of OpenBSD from NetBSD), as well as differences in the technical orientation that simply cause people to focus on different things. Since all the frequent contributors to these systems have already overfull schedules, it turns out that there's nobody in the end who actually finds time to spend into merging. Mind you, there are a number of developers who work in multiple camps, and i think a good number of people is listening in the other's mailing lists and newgroups. There are also smaller projects which can be finished in an overseeable period of time where developers tend to cooperate. (This is also true for cooperation with Linux developers.) > I must pose a question to all of the *BSD developers: At this > point in time, is it at all possible for the various *BSD teams to > work in conjunction? ``work in conjunction'' is something very different than ``unify the code base''. If you're speaking about the latter, it seems you don't estimate even remotely the amount of work it would require... > I have heard people say that the presence of multiple BSD > systems is comparable to the fact that there are multiple Linux > distributions. I disagree wholeheartedly with this notion. The Linux > distributions share the same kernel, while with BSD there are now > three separate teams working on three separate kernels. The BSD teams share mostly the same utilities however. The different kernels are natural, given the different orientation of the groups. > Is this not a > waste of resources? It is. But it's not so easy to overcome. If it were, be assured it would have happened before. > One must ask: Are there any fundamental > differences between the various systems that would prevent the source > base from being unified? The amount of work that will be required to make this happen is the most preventing factor. Remember, all these groups are doing it for fun. If it's no longer fun to do your fun work, it usually only leads to one result: you stop doing it, and look for another hobby. Mind you, release work is already non-funny enough, but it needs to be done. I've only seen very few people ever popping up and saying: ``Hey, i'm here, i've got plenty of time to burn, i'm eager to burn it in merging FooBSD's and BarBSD's code base.'' Actually, i remember only one person so far coming up with this. I remember much more people arguing with rationale arguments ``that it needs to be done'' however. Note the passive voice in that sentence... > I hope I've raised some valid points. Further discussion, > especially from the core team members and developers would be > appreciated. Disclaimer: Note that this is no coordinated opinion of any core team whatsoever, it's just my personal observation. However, i'm fairly confident that other BSD developers have made similar experiences. -- J"org Wunsch Unix support engineer joerg_wunsch@interface-business.de http://www.interface-business.de/~j